PNC 08/05/19

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  • legal standing
  • anything Pirate_Joe has to check in with


  • Sayyida: Megan Klein Chair, WI
  • Bosun: Joe Klein Secretary, Wisconsin
  • Pirate_Joe: Joseph Onoroski, Vice-Chair, Ma
  • jokeefe: James O’Keefe, Massachusetts


  • Motion passed: draft a written proposal for why we are organizing the way we are so people can review, comment and decide whether that works for us.
    • Bosun will send draft document


Record of the meeting


[9:02pm] Sayyida: I call the meeting
[9:02pm] Sayyida: let's get started
[9:02pm] Sayyida: Megan Klein Chair, WI
[9:02pm] Bosun: Joe Klein Secretary, Wisconsin
[9:02pm] Pirate_Joe: Joseph Onoroski, Vice-Chair, Ma
[9:03pm] jokeefe: James O’Keefe, Massachusetts
[9:03pm] Sayyida: alrighty those are our 3 board members,
[9:03pm] Sayyida: agenda is legal standing and anything Pirate_Joe has to check in with
[9:04pm] Pirate_Joe: Please post up the agenda for tonight?
[9:05pm] Sayyida: The new agenda site has been a sticky thing and I was hoping we could use something else
[9:05pm] Pirate_Joe: Also, could I have someone educate us(me being a layman) on how to review past meeting notes
[9:05pm] jokeefe: how about our own wiki?
[9:05pm] Pirate_Joe: So perhaps a decision on that tonight as well
[9:05pm] Sayyida: jokeefe, sounds good to me, how do we use it
[9:06pm] jokeefe:
[9:06pm] papegaai: Title: United States Pirate Party (at
[9:06pm] jokeefe: I believe everyone has accounts.
[9:06pm] Sayyida: I am not familiar with wiki, and I would be happy to learn more about it so we have back ups
[9:07pm] jokeefe: I’ll create a page.  We should have a training session then.
[9:07pm] Sayyida: jokeefe, sounds good
[9:07pm] Sayyida: Bosun, do we have the legal ID yet?
[9:08pm] Bosun: You mean EIN?
[9:08pm] Pirate_Joe: jokeefe, it appears that I do not have an account with the national wiki
[9:08pm] Sayyida: yes
[9:09pm] Pirate_Joe: I believe that is what she means Bosun
[9:09pm] Bosun: Not yet - I'll file it tonight.
[9:09pm] jokeefe: ok, will create a wiki account for whomever needs it
[9:09pm] Pirate_Joe: Jokeefe brought forth some legitimate questions about that topic
[9:09pm] Sayyida: lets hear them
[9:09pm] Sayyida: jokeefe, ?
[9:10pm] jokeefe:
[9:10pm] papegaai: Title: PNC 08/05/19 - United States Pirate Party (at
[9:10pm] jokeefe: I am concerned about why we are filing as a coop and not an FEC PAC.
[9:11pm] Sayyida: Bosun, this was your filing, would you please explain this one
[9:11pm] jokeefe: It would be good to compare them to understand why a coop is the right choice
[9:12pm] Sayyida: to my understanding jokeefe this was a decision made to prevent someone running away with all the money again
[9:12pm] Sayyida: to prevent power grabs
[9:12pm] jokeefe: ok, I don’t understand how it does that.
[9:13pm] Pirate_Joe: There are some concerns on how we are able to use the money on a PAC like MA, since we will be very limited on how we can receive money from a corp entity.
[9:13pm] jokeefe: why would we want to receive money from a corporation?
[9:13pm] Pirate_Joe: co-op/corp.  etc
[9:14pm] Bosun: The corporate structure does not matter. The coop just defines a corporate structure, like and LLC, or S corp, or limited partnership.
[9:14pm] jokeefe: so we could be a coop and file with the FEC?
[9:14pm] jokeefe: as a PAC?
[9:15pm] Bosun: Yes.
[9:15pm] Pirate_Joe: Then this is simply a failure on my part to explain this properly to jokeefe, I am sorry
[9:15pm] Sayyida: I am not familier with legal wording so I leave this to those with legal knowlage
[9:15pm] Bosun: The coop makes it an association - the membership being state parties, each with one vote.
[9:15pm] Pirate_Joe: I thought they were one or the other.
[9:16pm] Sayyida: we are at half time, as a reminder.
[9:17pm] Bosun: We need some sort of corporate structure for an EIN - which we need for IRS filings.
[9:17pm] jokeefe: No worries. Perhaps we should have it all written up and present it to sab for review.  That way we documentation on how we are organized and why
[9:18pm] Sayyida: sounds fair. Bosun can you please take care of that?
[9:18pm] Pirate_Joe: Ok
[9:18pm] Pirate_Joe: One thing
[9:18pm] Bosun: Coops kinda by the nature define it as a one member one vote organization, as apposed to a corp where votes predetermined by capital contribution.
[9:19pm] jokeefe: Then it should be easy to square with our bylaws.
[9:19pm] Pirate_Joe: May I have access to the SAB list as well as the wiki for the national level?
[9:19pm] jokeefe: sure
[9:20pm] jokeefe: anyone on sab can post to it
[9:20pm] Pirate_Joe: So I would purpose that we commit to posting an SAB mailing Monthly and recommit to doing a monthly Video
[9:20pm] jokeefe: It isn’t
[9:20pm] papegaai: Title: | nulla tenaci invia est via (at
[9:20pm] Bosun: I set it up with single share for each state, district, and territory - so 56 shares. The recognized party buys one share at $1 par value.
[9:21pm] Bosun: Each recognized entity has one vote.
[9:21pm] jokeefe: The sab list is supposed to be made up of all state party representatives, so it isn’t an announce mailing list
[9:22pm] Pirate_Joe: Do we have an announce mailing list ?
[9:22pm] jokeefe:
[9:22pm] papegaai: Title: | nulla tenaci invia est via (at
[9:22pm] Sayyida: Pirate_Joe, yes crew should be it
[9:22pm] Pirate_Joe: I don't seem to have access to either of the last two links
[9:23pm] jokeefe: So if we are going to have shares, which as a non-profit seems strange, then we need to change our bylaws.
[9:23pm] jokeefe: Bosun can add you to
[9:23pm] papegaai: Title: | nulla tenaci invia est via (at
[9:23pm] Sayyida: jokeefe, we are working on rewriting them anyways, I assume we can work it in, right?
[9:24pm] Pirate_Joe: Updating the bylaws is next on the list.  I personally was going to try and spearhead that.  Sayyida offered her assistance as well.  I would love any help I can get to be honest.
[9:24pm] jokeefe: Sure, but we need to amend the bylaws first.  That is why I believe we need a proposal.
[9:25pm] jokeefe: I can help with that.
[9:25pm] Bosun: It is a membership token - the shares.
[9:25pm] Sayyida: we are at 5 min til time should we motion for more time?
[9:25pm] Pirate_Joe: Motion to add 10 minutes of time.
[9:25pm] jokeefe: 2nd
[9:25pm] Pirate_Joe: All in favor?
[9:25pm] Sayyida: aye
[9:25pm] jokeefe: aye
[9:25pm] Pirate_Joe: aye
[9:26pm] Bosun: aye
[9:26pm] Pirate_Joe: Against?
[9:26pm] Sayyida: time extended to 40 past the hour
[9:27pm] Pirate_Joe: So what Jokeefe speaks to is that in MA, first we propose an idea, send it to the activist list and then the following week we make a decision on the matter.
[9:27pm] Pirate_Joe: At least most of the time we do.
[9:27pm] jokeefe: Can we have a proposal for the next meeting to review and vote on either at the next meeting or amend and vote on at following meeting?
[9:27pm] Sayyida: sure
[9:27pm] Pirate_Joe: Having more states involved may slow down things but often good decisions should not be rushed.
[9:27pm] jokeefe: Thank you.
[9:28pm] jokeefe: Aye
[9:28pm] Sayyida: understood, but have we not filed already? Bosun its not too late correct?
[9:28pm] Pirate_Joe: So instead of sending it to the activist list, send to the crew list?
[9:28pm] Pirate_Joe: So long as we can file as a FEC/PAC, I have nothing to contest.
[9:28pm] Bosun: Filed what? EIN?
[9:29pm] Pirate_Joe: Jokeefe, are you satisfied with Bosun's answer?
[9:29pm] Sayyida: yes, its not too late to change from coop to pac?
[9:29pm] Pirate_Joe: There may be no need for that Sayyida
[9:29pm] jokeefe: Nothing special about getting an EIN
[9:30pm] Sayyida: If it is open to change, it needs to be opened to be changed
[9:30pm] Bosun: A PAC is an IRS designation.
[9:30pm] Sayyida: 10 min til time
[9:31pm] jokeefe: 501c3, 501c4, 527 are an IRS designations.
[9:31pm] Bosun: A coop can be anything a corporation can be, except undemocratic.
[9:32pm] jokeefe: Green Party is an FEC PAC and has a democratic structure.
[9:32pm] Pirate_Joe: @jokeefe
[9:32pm] Pirate_Joe: so we could be a coop and file with the FEC?
[9:32pm] Pirate_Joe: as a PAC?
[9:32pm] Pirate_Joe: Bosun
[9:32pm] Pirate_Joe: Yes.
[9:33pm] Sayyida: and they have meetings about having meetings
[9:33pm] Sayyida: sorry the greens give me headaches and I want to be nothing like them
[9:33pm] jokeefe: we don’t have to do that
[9:33pm] Pirate_Joe: Yeah, being annoying may be fun, but gets old quickly enough
[9:33pm] Bosun: Where are the greens incorporated?
[9:34pm] Sayyida: we are nearly at 5 min til time
[9:35pm] jokeefe: don’t know where they are incorporated, Bosun
[9:35pm] Sayyida: jokeefe, are you satisfied with Bosuns answer?
[9:35pm] jokeefe: I don’t know what answer you refer to
[9:35pm] Pirate_Joe: Actually, how do we then accept funds from the national party if they are a coop and not a PAC
[9:36pm] Sayyida: you seem to be concerned with coop vs a pac or am I mistaken
[9:36pm] Bosun: You are mixing apple and organges.
[9:36pm] Bosun: It is not a coop vs. a PAC.
[9:36pm] Sayyida: Like I said I am not familar with the legal complications
[9:37pm] jokeefe: I believe we need a written proposal for why we are organizing the way we are so people can review, comment and decide whether that works for us
[9:37pm] Sayyida: I am trying to resolve time as we are 3 min til time
[9:37pm] Bosun: A PAC is not a corporate structure.
[9:37pm] Sayyida: and we should have one next meeting then
[9:37pm] jokeefe: Motion: draft a written proposal for why we are organizing the way we are so people can review, comment and decide whether that works for us
[9:37pm] Pirate_Joe: 2nd
[9:37pm] Sayyida: second
[9:37pm] Pirate_Joe: <3
[9:37pm] Pirate_Joe: All in favor?
[9:37pm] jokeefe: aye
[9:37pm] Pirate_Joe: aye
[9:37pm] Sayyida: aye
[9:38pm] Bosun: abstain
[9:38pm] Pirate_Joe: Against?
[9:38pm] Sayyida: none. Motion passes
[9:38pm] jokeefe: Bosun would you like help drafting the proposal?
[9:39pm] Pirate_Joe: I also would be happy to help, Bosun
[9:39pm] Bosun: I will send you both a draft.
[9:39pm] Sayyida: good
[9:40pm] jokeefe: Thank you!
[9:40pm] Sayyida: is there anything else? we are at time
[9:40pm] Pirate_Joe: Motion to adjourn
[9:40pm] jokeefe: 2nd
[9:40pm] Pirate_Joe: All in favor?
[9:40pm] Sayyida: aye
[9:40pm] Pirate_Joe: Aye
[9:40pm] jokeefe: aye