Outreach 07/20/2021

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  • Anthony Jay, IN
  • Mitchel Davilo, Chicagoland/ILPP, Swarmcare Manager
  • Rose Klein, CA, USPP chair
  • Joe Klein, USPP vice-chair


Old Business

  • discussion of posting schedule and site modifications (tabled 07/13/2021)



[8:18:53 PM] <wodensday> Should we go ahead and officially start then?
[8:18:58 PM] <Yari> https://wiki.uspirates.org/w/index.php?title=Outreach_07/20/2021
[8:18:59 PM] <papegaai> Title: Outreach 07/20/2021 - United States Pirate Party (at wiki.uspirates.org)
[8:19:12 PM] <Bosun> Sorry - potty training, when he needds to go I gotta go.
[8:19:28 PM] <wodensday> Perfectly alright lol
[8:19:38 PM] <wodensday> Let's get a cleaner list of IDs:
[8:19:42 PM] <wodensday> Anthony Jay, IN
[8:19:57 PM] <pmchi> Mitchel Davilo, Chicagoland/ILPP, Swarmcare Manager
[8:20:03 PM] <Yari> Rose Klein, CA, USPP chair
[8:21:15 PM] <wodensday> Moving on to old business:
[8:21:37 PM] <Yari> discussion of posting schedule and site modifications
[8:22:05 PM] <Yari> re: website blog posts, that is
[8:22:54 PM] <wodensday> Exactly. Website is ready, where do we go now?
[8:24:04 PM] <wodensday> I suggested to Yari in private the other day that we should run the website somewhat like a publication. That is, try to give everyone a set posting schedule or "column". Thoughts?
[8:25:47 PM] <pmchi> I think that’s smart. At minimum, I think at least one new post a week would be healthy, one new post a day is ideal.
[8:26:17 PM] <Bosun> content is the problem.
[8:26:30 PM] <Yari> staggering updates by having members with different days that they post on could be nice
[8:26:47 PM] <Yari> To Bosun's point - what are people going to write about?
[8:27:09 PM] <Yari> If each writer has an area of specialization, that might make things easier.
[8:27:48 PM] <wodensday> personally, I thought earlier today that someone should write about how big news stories impact the pirate ideology.
[8:28:13 PM] <wodensday> News through the pirate lens
[8:29:32 PM] <wodensday> Calls to action should be a big focus 
[8:32:25 PM] <Bosun> Meet me at The Indiana State Soldiers and Sailors Monument Sunday at 5PM - bring your cutlass.
[8:32:54 PM] <wodensday> If you say so
[8:33:01 PM] <Yari> ???
[8:33:11 PM] <Bosun> Indiana joke.
[8:33:37 PM] <wodensday> Anyway, anyway
[8:33:52 PM] <wodensday> Specialization could be another benefit of this schedule, yes.
[8:34:20 PM] <Yari> wodensday, that's only one focus - would you suggest multiple people writing about news? we could have people focusing on different news areas, I suppose
[8:34:23 PM] <wodensday> I would encourage everyone who writes regularly to have a niche or brand to their "column". Not necessary though
[8:34:29 PM] <Bosun> I see a bunch of currennt events we could comment on. Don't know if qwe would agree on the commentary.
[8:34:56 PM] <Yari> Bosun, I don't think agreement is necessarily the point, so long as each column is appropriately authored
[8:35:05 PM] <Yari> and has at least one pass through an editor
[8:36:00 PM] <Bosun> Who gets the red pencil?
[8:36:17 PM] → Radiojoe has joined
[8:36:19 PM] <Yari> It could be a rotating red pencil
[8:36:20 PM] <wodensday> Dialogue and debate between two of our soapboxes sounds healthy to me
[8:36:42 PM] <Yari> rotating column, rotating red pencil
[8:36:58 PM] <pmchi> And as long as content is consistently produced, difference of opinion can be boiled down to author’s opinion. We could approve/disapprove via majority opinion? If not, simply follow our Pirate rule of twos
[8:37:23 PM] <pmchi> The “unsure? Ask two pirates” rule/suggestion
[8:37:27 PM] <Bosun> Copy editors are special people.
[8:37:28 PM] <wodensday> There would be a certain standard. No manifestos of our own morals without substance, more "This happaned this week, this is why I think it goes against our value of humanism/transparency/ticks/etc"
[8:38:07 PM] <Yari> Bosun, fair point
[8:39:44 PM] <wodensday> We can always use majority opinion for now, and f=come up with a better solution as we get more data
[8:40:04 PM] <Yari> majority opinion to do what?
[8:40:35 PM] <wodensday> Majority opinion on the message and intent of a piece
[8:40:48 PM] <wodensday> As to whether or not it is suitable 
[8:41:16 PM] <Yari> so I'm hearing you say that people would vote on whether or not a piece should be posted before it's posted?
[8:41:20 PM] <Bosun> I think it is good for people to stick out their necks and propose things.
[8:41:29 PM] <Yari> where would that voting take place?
[8:42:05 PM] <Yari> That feels like a long process from inception to posting
[8:42:19 PM] <wodensday> You're probably right. 
[8:42:45 PM] <wodensday> How concerned are we really about quality control?
[8:42:50 PM] <Yari> if we want pieces to be posted more than weekly, and we want to do anything other than read and edit during these meetings...
[8:43:06 PM] <Bosun> I like voting in the comment section ... "Bosun that is crazy" is easy to ccut and past into the commeentss.
[8:43:36 PM] <wodensday> I really think we need pirate blogging to kick off as soon as possible. How can we get there?
[8:43:58 PM] <Bosun> New keyboard has nasty keybounce.
[8:44:22 PM] <Yari> I think that having a sanity check for writers is a good idea before they publish
[8:44:31 PM] <Yari> But it doesn't need to be much
[8:44:40 PM] <Bosun> We can use some feeds.
[8:44:47 PM] <Yari> I.e, have them interact with one other writer who reads their work
[8:44:49 PM] <wodensday> Some kind of writer approval process?
[8:44:58 PM] <wodensday> Or something more casual
[8:45:02 PM] <Bosun> PPPI iss reesurecting pirate times.
[8:45:08 PM] <Bosun> PPI
[8:45:27 PM] <wodensday> Pirate Party Pinternational 
[8:47:37 PM] <wodensday> Again, I'm hearing that we have quality control concerns, is that correct?
[8:48:04 PM] <pmchi> Would there be a process where we could write articles and post them, but they wouldn’t be public until receiving moderator approval?
[8:48:44 PM] <pmchi> I feel that would speed up the process of getting articles out there, but they would be filtered and/or tweaked by trusted pirates before going public
[8:50:08 PM] <pmchi> Might receive spam/trolls posting, but if moderator approval in place, only we’d see it and it would get deleted before anyone could ever see it. Wouldn’t even leave the “pending approval” or “draft” section it’d be under
[8:50:45 PM] <Bosun> We pass thee draft for english, spelling, and feedback.
[8:50:51 PM] <wodensday> That should be easy to do on Wordpress.
[8:51:19 PM] <wodensday> Reminds me of the tweetdeck proposal. Can't we do the exact same thing here?
[8:51:29 PM] <wodensday> Captain and Vice Captain oversee the operation
[8:51:44 PM] <Bosun> You just put up a draft -- tell the editors it is up and give it the thumbs up or down.
[8:52:36 PM] <Yari> yeah that would work fine as well, although I'll be honest I'm not so much a fan of giving the chair and vice-chair ownership of yet another thing
[8:52:49 PM] <Yari> It's definitely the easier process to set up
[8:53:12 PM] <Bosun> All the content management systems have a draft system.
[8:53:50 PM] <wodensday> Should we give it to swarmcare?
[8:53:57 PM] <Bosun> NNo they volunteer us ffor all the work. :-)
[8:53:59 PM] <wodensday> The control
[8:55:09 PM] <Yari> I don't think any of the officers should have it - I think it should be a round robin, where each writer is paired with another writer who is designated as their 'editor' for the week
[8:55:21 PM] <wodensday> Sort of like a buddy system?
[8:55:37 PM] <Yari> yes, in a sense, but it rotates
[8:55:38 PM] <Bosun> I tend to err on the side of minimal censorship.
[8:55:51 PM] <wodensday> I'm down for that
[8:56:21 PM] <wodensday> (Also, does anybody mind stretching this to 15-20 after to make up for our delay?)
[8:56:28 PM] <Yari> yeah that's fine
[8:56:44 PM] <Bosun> Rotations only work where everyone has equal talent.
[8:57:40 PM] <Yari> Bosun, but each writer would be paired with different editors each week
[8:57:46 PM] <Yari> I'm not sure how to word this well
[8:57:51 PM] <Bosun> We get a bigger teem people will settle into specialties.
[8:58:59 PM] <Yari> it's more of a lottery system that I'm suggesting
[8:59:07 PM] <Bosun> I woorked withh the Shepherd Express and one editor can work with a dozen writers.
[8:59:38 PM] <Yari> you could have a specialty in this system, actually - to your point Bosun.
[9:00:25 PM] <Bosun> The blood sweat is in the composition of good creative content.
[9:01:00 PM] <pmchi> We’ll still need to fluff up the website in the mean time. Might I suggest we post, via USPirates.org, about upcoming meetings? That way we got two posts minimal a week.
[9:01:22 PM] <wodensday> That's a fantastic idea. 
[9:01:47 PM] <Yari> I retract my previous statement
[9:01:57 PM] → nolan_ has joined
[9:02:15 PM] <wodensday> I think we're getting a little lost here. So, say I write something tomorrow and I'm proud of it and want to publish. What would happen, and what SHOULD happen?
[9:02:20 PM] ← nolan has left (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[9:02:21 PM] ⓘ nolan_ is now known as nolan
[9:03:55 PM] <Yari> we should also think here about how to approve writers
[9:05:03 PM] <Bosun> You write up the draft in wiki or wordpress and let someone else look at it to clear it for publication (by clicking the publish button)
[9:05:20 PM] <Yari> easiest method to implement is the one we talked about earlier, where certain officers are the ones who allow publication
[9:05:46 PM] <Yari> we can implement that as a stopgap system... today.
[9:05:58 PM] <wodensday> Does that work for the time being, until we can muse about other options and get more information? If it does, I think we should work on getting pirates writing
[9:06:03 PM] <Yari> I guess I'm arguing that it should only be a stopgap
[9:07:00 PM] <wodensday> We can and should revisit this, definitely 
[9:08:32 PM] <Bosun> I don't think we should be afraid of controversy -- but I like the idea of no anon writers.
[9:08:56 PM] <wodensday> Seconded, jokeefe already suggested we identify every post
[9:09:54 PM] <wodensday> Yari, to your point about writer approval, do you have any suggestions?
[9:10:00 PM] <Bosun> The "nuts" tend to hide behind anonymity.
[9:10:43 PM] <Yari> Bosun as much as I hear where you're coming from, I can think of four counter-examples off the top of my head
[9:11:23 PM] <Yari> people who want to hide hide
[9:11:42 PM] <Yari> wodensday, I don't know, honestly
[9:12:02 PM] <Yari> there are many ways we can run approvals
[9:12:34 PM] <wodensday> Should the outreach committee suggest nominations to the PNC for approval?
[9:12:48 PM] <Bosun> OK you got me "Libertas".
[9:12:52 PM] <Yari> wodensday I don't think this is PNC approval territory
[9:13:24 PM] <wodensday> Fair enough, still gaging how much we can do on our own
[9:14:19 PM] <wodensday> Should outreach do a vote, then? Mainly on character, but writing samples could also be submitted if they like
[9:14:37 PM] <Bosun> The Federalist Papers being all under pseudonyms.
[9:16:05 PM] <Bosun> Let other complain and adjust after the fact - no prior constraint - how much rope do you want?
[9:17:20 PM] <wodensday> Point is, any controversy will be assigned to our own faces.
[9:17:28 PM] <wodensday> Which is a good thing for the most part
[9:18:08 PM] <wodensday> How do we feel about writer approval as conducted democratically by outreach?
[9:18:29 PM] <Bosun> Yes - responsible people can handle it and admit mistakes when they happen.
[9:19:12 PM] <wodensday> If someone wants to make a proposal on this, we could surely vote on it next meeting
[9:19:50 PM] <Bosun> Editing by committee tends to dumb things down.
[9:21:04 PM] <wodensday> Alright, I believe we've made up for our time. Does anybody wish to motion to adjourn?
[9:21:12 PM] <Bosun> Moved: Outreach recruits writers and outreach is responsible for editorial content.
[9:21:27 PM] <Yari> second to bosun's motion
[9:21:43 PM] <wodensday> Excellent. Adjourned. I will fix up our wiki page.
[9:21:53 PM] <Yari> wait, what?
[9:22:05 PM] <wodensday> Oh, hold on
[9:22:07 PM] <Bosun> motion on the floor.
[9:22:07 PM] <Yari> that wasn't an adjourn motion
[9:22:10 PM] <wodensday> Bosun is confusing me
[9:22:23 PM] <wodensday> I wasn't paying attention
[9:22:38 PM] <Bosun> OK I move fasst.
[9:23:33 PM] <wodensday> ...Whoops
[9:23:35 PM] <Bosun> aaccept my motion then adjourn.
[9:24:01 PM] <wodensday> Motion accepted
[9:24:37 PM] <wodensday> Adjourned? Said hesitantly 
[9:24:44 PM] <Yari> motion to adjourn
[9:25:04 PM] <Bosun> call the vote, then I mmove that aafter the vvote we adjourn
[9:25:25 PM] <Yari> yeah we need to vote on the motion that's on the table
[9:25:30 PM] <Yari> (bosun's motion)
[9:25:37 PM] <wodensday> Yes, yes
[9:25:45 PM] <wodensday> Vote called, motion accepted
[9:26:14 PM] <wodensday> Do we have a second to the motion to adjourn Bosun has also made?
[9:26:21 PM] <Bosun> no we need to record the vote
[9:26:31 PM] <wodensday> Hm?
[9:26:47 PM] <Bosun> yari 2nd
[9:26:47 PM] <wodensday> Oh I have made this a whole mess. My apologies
[9:27:23 PM] <Bosun> It takes some time to get thee meeting thing.
[9:27:45 PM] <Yari> as in, "all in favor?"
[9:27:52 PM] <wodensday> All in favor?
[9:27:53 PM] <Yari> and then we actually vote on it
[9:27:55 PM] <Yari> aye
[9:28:01 PM] <Bosun> aye
[9:28:17 PM] <wodensday> Excellent
[9:28:21 PM] <Yari> "motion passes"
[9:28:31 PM] <Bosun> move adjourn
[9:28:35 PM] <wodensday> ...Motion passes
[9:28:44 PM] <Yari> 2nd on the adjourn
[9:28:50 PM] <wodensday> Meeting adjourned?
[9:28:57 PM] <Yari> yeah, without objection
[9:29:19 PM] <Bosun> iff their are no objectiions.
[9:29:42 PM] <wodensday> There do not appear to be
[9:29:55 PM] <Yari> that's why you usually ask for any
[9:29:55 PM] <Bosun> thhen we are ajourned.
[9:30:04 PM] <Yari> before declaring adjournment
[9:30:04 PM] <wodensday> Meeting adjourned.