PNC 05/21/2023

May 21st, 2023

Agenda

Discussion

Old Business

• conference updates

New Business

• discussion of permissions and procedure for posting and cross posting to socials, blog, and discord announcements

Meeting Minutes

21:09:28 <Woden> Starting an informal discussion at 9:08 EDT.
 <Woden> IDs?
 <_xmxvx_> sarai ovied, tx :D
 <yari> Rose Klein, CA rep & USPP secretary
 <Quartermaster> Joseph Onoroski, Massachusetts, Treasurer, PPI rep, platform committee person.
 DreadPirateDrew has joined
 <Woden> Anthony Jay Porter, INPP non-voting member, chair of the PNC
 <Woden> Oh hey, we just went official
 <Woden> ID Drew!
 <DreadPirateDrew> Drew Bingaman PA Captain
 <yari> welcome
 <yari> & ahoy
 <DreadPirateDrew> ahoy
 <Quartermaster> Ahoy
 <_xmxvx_> oh also on record: commander of provisional outreach marines
 <_xmxvx_> ahoy!
 <yari> I suggest that for this meeting, we skip through reports by simply asking anyone with relevant reports to give them
 <Woden> IL alternate may be coming
 <Woden> Any objections to Yari's proposal?
 <yari> I would like to get through this meeting quickly so that we can maybe break early with action items and get work done for the conference
 <_xmxvx_> * thumbs up *
 <Quartermaster> I am fine with a quick meeting. 
 <Woden> I will start by asking for anyone who has an officer or committee report to say "Report"
 <yari> none from me
 <_xmxvx_> Report
 <Quartermaster> Treasury is the same amount. 
 <Woden> Okay, one report from V. Let's hear it!
 <Quartermaster> Things got done with Platform but I didn't do it.
 <_xmxvx_> Outreach has no new business. We're working on a lot of templates for regions/designs using canva. Also formatting blog posts on Google Docs.
 <_xmxvx_> Also, Pirate Chat we had scribble.io fun
 <_xmxvx_> That's all.
 <Quartermaster> Question?
 <Quartermaster> For outreach 
 <_xmxvx_> Yes
 <Woden> You may ask
 <Quartermaster> Did we respond to the Andy/Goldperson case?
 <Quartermaster> Or post about it?
 <Woden> This is something that slipped my radar. V?
 <_xmxvx_> Is that the one with the Prince copyright? Not yet. There was a great start of a post/comment in platform.
 <Quartermaster> A tweet would do too.
 <_xmxvx_> Before I could do anything further I requested more information.
 <Woden> If we want a tweet then someone should send me copy for it and it can be done
 <_xmxvx_> One second, I didn't finish. I requested more information on permissions or procedures to: x post announcements on discord x post on the blog x post on our socials
 <Quartermaster> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andy_Warhol_Foundation_for_the_Visual_Arts,_Inc._v._Goldsmith
 <papegaai> Title: Andy Warhol Foundation for the Visual Arts, Inc. v. Goldsmith - Wikipedia (at en.m.wikipedia.org)
 <_xmxvx_> If we get what's started in platform to AJ, that's a good solution for today :)
 <Quartermaster> We did a short piece on it in Mass pirate news, if that helps.
 <yari> for today, but not for in general, which is why I think its important to talk abt today
 <yari> thanks for report though
 ElmoMusk has joined
 <Quartermaster> Thank you for humoring me.
 <yari> and a constant thank you for rallying the folks
 <yari> wishing i could have joined pirate chat
 <Woden> Okay. Next up on the agenda according to the mock one Yari wants us to follow is 40 minutes of conference planning
 <yari> nope
 <yari> maybe?
 <yari> i dunno
 <yari> I think either that or talk about v's agenda item
 <yari> or both
 <_xmxvx_> They're both very important.
 <yari> agreed
 <Woden> Oh, is that pseudo out of order?
 ElmoMusk has quit
 <Woden> What is V's agenda item?
 <_xmxvx_> One idea is to have things ready for officers to post on the blog/social. Then table the discussion about permissions and procedures.
 <_xmxvx_> "can I request a time to talk about permissions or procedures to: x post announcements on discord x post on the blog x post on our socials"
 <yari> ^
 <yari> procedures especially, I feel
 <yari> we don't have a clear procedure about posting online, and I think the more we do it the more important having this discussion it
 <yari> *is
 <yari> we can table it for another time but it needs to happen soon
 <Woden> What kind of procedures do we want?
 <Woden> Should be known that I am always down to talk about stuff like this
 <yari> that's a great question. My thought is that it would be nice for there to be a way that any pirate can three-pirate-rule a post together and then have it run through a trusted group of editors and posted without intervention of admin
 <_xmxvx_> I know that I have a few items that volunteers want to contribute to the blog. So, that's one aspect of a pipeline we could have. 1_collection 2_edit read by 3pirates 3_sent to posting officer
 <Woden> So far all of these things are separate lists of people that have some loose connection to current or former officers
 <Woden> We have some kind of system for the blog that we don't really use from around a year ago. Do you remember Yari?
 <_xmxvx_> Also, I feel that we have a lot of things we want to move into advisory members roles.
 <Woden> It was very close to the three Pirate rule, but one of them had to be an approved editor or something
 <Quartermaster> We could do an open blog input but usually spam bots make the editorial process a huge task.
 <yari> I think it may have just been that?
 <yari> Joe there are some really simple and effective ways to deter spam bots
 <yari> especially on drupal
 <Quartermaster> I trust in your internet prowess then.
 <DreadPirateDrew> I would rather not have a gatekeeper, 
 <Quartermaster> This is also true
 <_xmxvx_> Can you explain more about a gatekeeper?
 <yari> I say 'trusted group of editors' and realize that's just a proxy for admin
 <yari> aka a gatekeeper
 <_xmxvx_> In one aspect, it could be a committee that is the review board of the content.
 <yari> gotta democratize that shit somehow
 <DreadPirateDrew> My preference would be if it has approval of 3 pirates, it goes up.
 <Woden> I believe our shelved system (due to lack of recruits) was that anyone can submit to an approved editor who can workshop it with them and eventually post it with them
 <yari> Agreed with drew
 <Quartermaster> Plus it seems like outreach would be the admin for blogs anyways. 
 <Woden> I disagree with that.
 <_xmxvx_> I like that Drew
 <yari> We can always take stuff down if its bad
 <_xmxvx_> the revision is done on the 3 pirate level
 <yari> And there's the pressure of making something you know is going to be public
 <Woden> Blog posts play a big role on our brand and how we are seen, it's perceived coming straight from our mouth as an organization
 <_xmxvx_> another idea could be content submission > 3 pirate review > post
 <Woden> I want a variety of perspectives to be present with some level of gatekeeping
 <yari> I think there's also the point here that any 3 pirates who are a part of this will be pirates who have submitted their info to our lists
 <yari> so they can be held accountable 
 <DreadPirateDrew> I want to encourage the swarm, and keep the committee feel down. I would like us to be able to be more agile and less bureaucratic
 <Quartermaster> For the horde?!?!?!
 <yari> for the horde!
 <yari> we currently make almost no content
 <Woden> I like agility
 <yari> that clearly needs to change
 * _xmxvx_ gets sword ready
 <Woden> That is why we don't have only one or two editos
 <Woden> And why editors would ideally be a lot of people at the PNC and outreach level
 <_xmxvx_> agile is a dangerous territory. can you provide a context for how to submit and post the content?
 <yari> Also it can be more than 3 pirates
 <yari> That's just the minimum
 <_xmxvx_> For example, on wikipedia, there are editors who edit editors
 <Quartermaster> It's been quite a while since I created websites, so I would have to defer judgement and procedures to yall.
 <yari> I'm with drew on this one. I think adding more steps makes this process slower and more difficult. We've posted things before where it was one person writing it (pmchi, myself, woden, etc) and then checking it with 2 others. I think we should extend the same trust to our members.
 <DreadPirateDrew> Agreed Yari
 <DreadPirateDrew> We just need to note who the approvals are
 <Woden> I think the system we have is plenty easy and one-step, the editors are just a selective group
 <Quartermaster> Like you said as well, we can remove unwanted comments and hold those accountable as well.
 <_xmxvx_> In practice: would that look like sending a message to the officers via a Google Form or something like that? To get it posted?
 <_xmxvx_> For example: one volunteer has a 5part blog series on rank choiced voting
 <yari> v: I think in practice, it would be a form on the drupal backend. 
 <Quartermaster> Why not just make it the states at large, having outreach charged with monitoring the blogs it keep it in check.
 <_xmxvx_> 3 pirates have reviewed it. what happens next?
 <yari> It just posts
 <yari> I can automate that
 <_xmxvx_> oh sweet. automation!
 <Quartermaster> I think we all are going to check it anyways.
 <Woden> This has come up a bit, I really am pro some small level of gatekeeping while we get back into the swing of asserting our beliefs and carving out a political identity. We still attracting dozens of people per day who are not fit to be Pirates and not in the right mindset. It is hard to even post something on twitter without finding a tech bro disappointed that we believe in mandatory childhood vaccinations because he would have signed up otherwise
 <_xmxvx_> ah the joys of being an internet political party
 ElmoMusk has joined
 <DreadPirateDrew> Or we could just continue to not have content.
 <Woden> I do not want anything like that or pro Russian war crimes or whatever to end up anywhere enar us. And it's easy right now because nobody knows our true identity
 <Woden> Drew, heard, but quality over quantity to an extent
 <yari> I hear that concern Woden. I just think that's moderated more by a) the pressure of public writing on a blog, b) the three-pirate rule, and c) the filtering effect set up by them having to be approved members who have given us their contact info already
 Quartermaster has quit
 <yari> The posters will NOT be anonymous
 Quartermaster has joined
 <yari> Woden
 <yari> We will have their info
 <DreadPirateDrew> Nor should the sign offs be private
 <yari> I'm not saying give them MORE trust than we have now
 <Quartermaster> Aye
 <yari> I'm saying give them the SAME trust that we have now
 <DreadPirateDrew> We should all know who the author is and who green lit each post. That's all we need
 <yari> We are not anonymous
 <yari> So if they want to post, they should not be either
 <Woden> The posters will not be anonymous, people are still greenlighting posts that will be speaking to our values as a party
 <Woden> It's not the party's personal social media, it's our brand
 <_xmxvx_> Can we have the greenlighters be officers/committee leaders
 <DreadPirateDrew> I don't care if to the public we use alias' but internally we should know who wrote and signed off.
 <_xmxvx_> ?
 <Woden> That's kinda the system we have/had, V
 <Woden> I like it
 <Quartermaster> I would add state captains can approve as well.
 <Woden> Anyone can be approved as an editor that we want under our current system, it's just a selective group
 <_xmxvx_> So in practice: collaborators create content > three or more (3+) pirates review content > greenlighter lights > content is posted
 Lightrider has joined
 <Woden> That all being said, we need to remember the conference before we log off
 <_xmxvx_> yes
 <_xmxvx_> can we do that now?
 Lightrider has quit
 <_xmxvx_> the blog posts can wait. the prince/warhol statement on twitter cannot
 <yari> The problem with the system that creates is that by having a different person post the content than the writer, it makes the process that much more less likely to happen
 <Woden> I understand, but that is a problem every party publication in history in the world has had and they have worked pretty well in a lot of cases still, still a fun and possibly active activity 
 <Quartermaster> Motion to table discussion until next week. 
 <yari> yeah, 2nd
 <yari> actuall
 <yari> hang on
 <yari> not next week
 <yari> 2 weeks please
 <yari> 3 weeks actually
 <yari> table until after conference is what I'm saying
 <Quartermaster> K, motion to table for three weeks
 <Woden> Wait, oh my god, when is our conference?
 <yari> Starts in a week and a half?
 <yari> which is why I want to work on it
 <Woden> I am going to
 <yari> we gotta get our shit together
 <_xmxvx_> <3 we will. growing pains.
 <Woden> I am going to not freak out
 <yari> mhmm
 * _xmxvx_ already freaked out 3 weeks ago
 <yari> one day at a time, woden
 <Woden> We have the support of the people. Conference time
 <yari> vote on tabling i guess?
 * _xmxvx_ adds glow spotlight on yari
 <DreadPirateDrew> aye to tabling
 <yari> aye also
 <Woden> That is everyone
 <Quartermaster> Aye
 <yari> great
 <Woden> Conference time
 <yari> I need to set up the voting form, but I can take time with that
 <yari> I want to make a document that everyone has access to that shows who is in what timeslot
 <yari> for the conference
 <yari> I think that takes top priority
 <Woden> I do want to apologize for my part in the backlog, it's been a bad 2-3 weeks admittedly
 <Woden> How can we do this?
 <yari> That's fine
 <yari> woden: do you have that form made?
 <yari> step one
 <yari> if not, do you have the link for it?
 <yari> (the old version)
 <Woden> It would be easiest for me to do everything with the form, I have a draft, I just need the energy to spend
 <yari> I fully disagree
 <_xmxvx_> rule 0 ser. take care of you first. be at your best to do your best :)
 <yari> Do you have the time and energy to do that today?
 <yari> Because I can make a copy of that form 
 <yari> If you send the link
 <yari> And we can crowdsource the update
 <Woden> Oh no
 <Woden> Where is my cryptdrive
 <Woden> One second
 <yari> take your time. By the end of the meeting or shortly thereafter would be great.
 <Woden> Breakthrough!
 <Woden> My draft is not here but the form is
 <_xmxvx_> !
 <Woden> I will send you an editor's link on discord
 <yari> amazing, thank you
 <yari> Who can help with updating that today?
 <yari> I can contribute a bit and give direction
 <Woden> Done
 <yari> got it
 <Quartermaster> Motion to adjourn?
 <yari> uh
 <_xmxvx_> word editing?
 <yari> no plz
 <_xmxvx_> we can go back to unofficial talking?
 <yari> Joe do you need to leave?
 <Quartermaster> I do, sry
 <Woden> Motion dying in 5
 <Woden> We can turn into informal discussion
 <Woden> Does require a vote though
 <DreadPirateDrew> second the motion to adjourn
 <Woden> All in favor?
 <yari> cool
 <yari> aye
 <DreadPirateDrew> aye
21:53:44 <Quartermaster> Aye